huh. there goes my pet theory for why so many people in this fandom are such enormous flaming assholes. back to the drawing board, then!
idek, man, I've heard the "if it's in the canon who needs fic" thing a zillion times and I guess I can sort of see it, but at the same time I don't see why that necessarily rules out writing a canon ship. futurefic! AU! missing scene! different POV! there's just so many ways to play with canon, it makes me sad to see canon ships that I love ruled out like that. :( but in this case I will concede that I think most people just don't love Aang and Katara like I do, haha. there is plenty of good Zuko/Mai fic and they're canon too, so.
I'm not going to apologize again, but I understand where you're coming from. and yes, I'm a condescending asshole--I think most people are idiots, not just the ones in fandom, and more so when it's late and I'm tired--but on the other hand, I do think refusing to read het just because it's het is immature and unconsciously sexist, and I do think I'm a more mature person now that I've grown out of that particular prejudice. (I also think I'm more mature now that I've grown out of thinking that feminism is unnecessary just because I never noticed any gender discrimination affecting me.) I am only speaking for myself; I probably did try to speak for other people in that incoherent ramble, so I'm sorry about that part: obviously I'm not qualified to talk on behalf of others. I'm not trying to put down others, only my idiot younger self. but yes, I do think that about myself, and if that's condescending... well, I've done worse things in my time.
as far as football fandom goes, though, I think you're misinterpreting me? or more likely I didn't state it clearly at all, that whole thing is a mess and I'm surprised anybody could get any sense out of it. look, nobody has to write anything, obviously. it is really damn hard to find out anything about women in this fandom, and I could hardly blame anyone for (a) not knowing anything about women in this fandom or (b) knowing a little but not enough to really care or (c) caring a little but not enough to write fic. but people do write it sometimes; I've seen excellent fic about women in this fandom. but then they have nowhere to put it except their own journals (and the much-maligned footiefic, if they're aware of its existence), and so almost nobody reads it except their friends, so... idk. I don't necessarily think a common forum would make a noticeable difference (especially not right away), but I do think there's a certain amount of serendipity that goes into finding something new to read. so who knows? I think it would be interesting to see. like I said above, I had to rant in order to start the discussion, and now I have some ideas of productive things I can do.
you know, it's funny, every once in a while I'm reminded of how bizarre the way I consume fandom really is. (I was thinking about this when I first read your comment, because to me wives and girlfriends are an intrinsic part of football fandom, not something that you have to dig for at all--but that's because I interact with canon mainly by reading blogs and twitter, many of which are very gossipy, rather than by watching games.) I don't read everything anymore, and there are definitely pairings that make me wince when I see them, but it always takes me aback a little when people say that they don't read such-and-such because they don't care about that pairing. I only think of it as a problem if I know them and I hate them. XD (unless "do not find interesting" was a euphemism for "hate" in which case: I feel you. I am so sorry.) tl;dr I'm weird! I need to remember that more often, before I make offensive generalizations based on my weird-ass self!
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idek, man, I've heard the "if it's in the canon who needs fic" thing a zillion times and I guess I can sort of see it, but at the same time I don't see why that necessarily rules out writing a canon ship. futurefic! AU! missing scene! different POV! there's just so many ways to play with canon, it makes me sad to see canon ships that I love ruled out like that. :( but in this case I will concede that I think most people just don't love Aang and Katara like I do, haha. there is plenty of good Zuko/Mai fic and they're canon too, so.
I'm not going to apologize again, but I understand where you're coming from. and yes, I'm a condescending asshole--I think most people are idiots, not just the ones in fandom, and more so when it's late and I'm tired--but on the other hand, I do think refusing to read het just because it's het is immature and unconsciously sexist, and I do think I'm a more mature person now that I've grown out of that particular prejudice. (I also think I'm more mature now that I've grown out of thinking that feminism is unnecessary just because I never noticed any gender discrimination affecting me.) I am only speaking for myself; I probably did try to speak for other people in that incoherent ramble, so I'm sorry about that part: obviously I'm not qualified to talk on behalf of others. I'm not trying to put down others, only my idiot younger self. but yes, I do think that about myself, and if that's condescending... well, I've done worse things in my time.
as far as football fandom goes, though, I think you're misinterpreting me? or more likely I didn't state it clearly at all, that whole thing is a mess and I'm surprised anybody could get any sense out of it. look, nobody has to write anything, obviously. it is really damn hard to find out anything about women in this fandom, and I could hardly blame anyone for (a) not knowing anything about women in this fandom or (b) knowing a little but not enough to really care or (c) caring a little but not enough to write fic. but people do write it sometimes; I've seen excellent fic about women in this fandom. but then they have nowhere to put it except their own journals (and the much-maligned footiefic, if they're aware of its existence), and so almost nobody reads it except their friends, so... idk. I don't necessarily think a common forum would make a noticeable difference (especially not right away), but I do think there's a certain amount of serendipity that goes into finding something new to read. so who knows? I think it would be interesting to see. like I said above, I had to rant in order to start the discussion, and now I have some ideas of productive things I can do.
you know, it's funny, every once in a while I'm reminded of how bizarre the way I consume fandom really is. (I was thinking about this when I first read your comment, because to me wives and girlfriends are an intrinsic part of football fandom, not something that you have to dig for at all--but that's because I interact with canon mainly by reading blogs and twitter, many of which are very gossipy, rather than by watching games.) I don't read everything anymore, and there are definitely pairings that make me wince when I see them, but it always takes me aback a little when people say that they don't read such-and-such because they don't care about that pairing. I only think of it as a problem if I know them and I hate them. XD (unless "do not find interesting" was a euphemism for "hate" in which case: I feel you. I am so sorry.) tl;dr I'm weird! I need to remember that more often, before I make offensive generalizations based on my weird-ass self!